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04-16-24 06:01 AM |
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| 0 users reading What are we currently able to do? | 1 bot |
| Main - Archived forums - SMG questions and issues - What are we currently able to do? | Hide post layouts | New reply |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 7/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Hello, I'm new around here, but I'm one of those people who likes to have everything planned before they begin something, and there's nothing I hate more than starting something and then learning that what I sought to do was impossible. Therefore, I'd like to confirm a few things.
Things I know we can do: Add models Use existing models Code pathing Texture edit Code script (to an extent, if there's something major we can't do, I'd like to know) Things I'm not sure if we can do: Animate objects and platforms Scale existing objects/enemies with animations Replace the meshes for animated objects/enemies Replace the textures for animated objects/enemies If I could get a clear grasp of what we can and can't do (more emphasis on can't do), that would be very helpful. |
| NWPlayer123 |
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Member Imma Snuggle You Level: 110 
Posts: 3101/3604 EXP: 14188839 Next: 220047 Since: 07-07-12 From: Colorado Last post: 3093 days ago Last view: 1250 days ago |
Yes we can replace any model's texture (has to be same size tho) though the script sometimes messes up and you have to do it manually, but it's not that difficult. We can't do anything with replacing/creating animated models...yet. You technically can animate an imported model, but it only has one joint and thus you can only move, scale, and rotate the entire model at once, or be sneaky and use paths or whatever. Yes we can use scale in animations, with the limitations mentioned above.
Code....we're not going to be messing with for a while, all things given it was a miracle we have the working powerups and a debug screen. We can edit existing animations for existing models (for cutscenes and such, although tedious), but other then that it's all BCSV tables and map editing. ____________________ "I hate playing musical chats" ~ Quote of the month |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 8/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Thank you, and just to clarify: You cannot both scale and retexture animated objects like enemies?
EDIT: Also, I assume any texture changes would have to apply to all enemies of that type? |
| NWPlayer123 |
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Member Imma Snuggle You Level: 110
Posts: 3102/3604 EXP: 14188839 Next: 220047 Since: 07-07-12 From: Colorado Last post: 3093 days ago Last view: 1250 days ago |
those are entirely different things. Swapping textures is literally just changing the colors of the pixels in the model, that's all that's different between any pictures, it has nothing to do with scaling. Scaling should work fine, if you really want feedback, play around with pyBCK and BMDView2. Textures are on a per-model/object basis. Think of it like this: BDL files are an archive. They have the vertices, polygons, materials, and textures. So it's all self-contained. If you want to change the texture for another enemy, change the corresponding model textures.
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| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 9/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Ah, on the scaling, I simply misunderstood what you were referring to "has to be the same size though". I now realize that you were referring to the texture's dimensions. Which makes a lot more sense. But thank you for answering anyways. |
| TheSpeedyMouse |
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Normal user Level: 42 
Posts: 33/403 EXP: 489674 Next: 31688 Since: 04-05-14 Last post: 2603 days ago Last view: 1659 days ago |
This is helpful! I'll see what I can do for my Bowser Jr. level. It's going to have a boss, but not really. You just have to ground pound on some pillars with enemies everywhere. If we ever end up learning how to make our own bosses then I will change the boss. |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 10/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Meh, if we can make things move (albeit with one bone animation), I have four ideas already on how to make bosses: You just take old bosses and make them work in new ways.
EX: I don't know if this would work, but if you can crush people with moving platforms, just turn Peewee pirahna on his butt (assuming that traps him), trapped in the sand pit from Fluzzard, and retexture him to look like he's a sand Pirahna plant, then you just have vines come out of the ground (they'd be 1 bone, but they'd crush you under the leaves on the end). Have some enemies spawn to make it more difficult. When you get close, you smash the egg part, which barely emerges from the ground. As usual, he'll die after a few hits. The problem is, how to get mario away from that. If you have invisible walls, you might be able to just blast mario out with some cleverly placed ones, but that would require a way of triggering events when the boss is at certain health (can we do that?), and has a possibility of dislodging peewee. Another problem is that it is too easy to get to the egg, just float into the center and wham. So, if it is possible, you could close 2-5 leafy "blast doors" made out of portions of a dome cover the underside, and be synced with his attacks. If it is possible to make them damage you on touch, that would also be good. Course, the event coding would be difficult, and this is just assumptions based on what NW said was possible. |
| TheSpeedyMouse |
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Normal user Level: 42
Posts: 34/403 EXP: 489674 Next: 31688 Since: 04-05-14 Last post: 2603 days ago Last view: 1659 days ago |
Posted by Krazyguy75 That is a cool idea, but I am not sure it is possible. I hope somebody with more knowledge responds. Maybe in my pillar idea, I could have a boss from some galaxy like the dragon, and re-texture it, and you will have to avoid it when ground-pounding on the pillars. Another idea I had for the boss is the gigantic Bowser fight, but have the red star and you have to find the meteorites while flying around. But your idea sounds cool! When you said sand pit with fluzzard, I assume you mean the sand boss and not the bird Fluzzard? |
| Stygmax |
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SMG2.5 Cartographer Level: 88 
Posts: 1889/2178 EXP: 6550011 Next: 100653 Since: 12-02-12 Last post: 388 days ago Last view: 388 days ago |
I'm pretty sure that we can't use boss health to trigger events, but I've been surprised before.
Other than that, with a lot of work, that idea might be able to be pulled off without ASM. Status: It was really, really fun, guys - thanks for the ride!
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| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 11/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
@Speedy: Yeah, Squizzard is what I meant.
Darn SMG and their confusing naming conventions. @Styg: I could tell it would be a lot of work, but it would probably be easier than figuring out how to ASM your own boss. There's never a perfect solution, just easier and harder ones. Which reminds me, can you move bosses around on objects like moving platforms? |
| TheSpeedyMouse |
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Normal user Level: 42
Posts: 35/403 EXP: 489674 Next: 31688 Since: 04-05-14 Last post: 2603 days ago Last view: 1659 days ago |
Posted by Stygmax If we can use boss health to trigger things that could be great! Also can we create our own animations? And I am assuming we can't make our own cut-scenes but can we change the words in a already made cut-scene? |
| blimpfruit00 |
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 Flurry Very blimpy, but not fruity. Level: 34 
Posts: 116/253 EXP: 248410 Next: 5241 Since: 11-09-13 From: The known universe Last post: 1193 days ago Last view: 732 days ago |
Yes, I believe text can be completely edited.
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| TheSpeedyMouse |
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Normal user Level: 42
Posts: 36/403 EXP: 489674 Next: 31688 Since: 04-05-14 Last post: 2603 days ago Last view: 1659 days ago |
Posted by blimpfruit00 Okay that is good. I am going to think about it and see what I can do.  |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 12/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
So, event IDs: What are they (specifically, the concept is obvious), and how do you use them?
Ok, understand "appear" and "dead", but what is "a" "b", "awake", etc |
| blimpfruit00 |
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Flurry Very blimpy, but not fruity. Level: 34
Posts: 118/253 EXP: 248410 Next: 5241 Since: 11-09-13 From: The known universe Last post: 1193 days ago Last view: 732 days ago |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 13/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Ok, then what do bosses use SW_A for? |
| shibboleet |
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 Fire Mario DROP TABLE users; Level: 123 Posts: 2497/4661 EXP: 20868298 Next: 362968 Since: 07-07-12 Last post: 1340 days ago Last view: 352 days ago |
Being activated. (Short n sweet) ____________________ a |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 17/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
So can we do water? If so, how does it work, since it looks like part of the model. |
| NWPlayer123 |
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Member Imma Snuggle You Level: 110
Posts: 3105/3604 EXP: 14188839 Next: 220047 Since: 07-07-12 From: Colorado Last post: 3093 days ago Last view: 1250 days ago |
That's...a really touchy subject xD Let's just say I have a plan to make it possible, it already is but looks terrible because the way they make water is through a blackscaled texture that they have the wii turn black into transparent so you have transparency. Unfortunately, that involves materials which nobody can edit yet except by hand, but I have a partially complete material copier script sitting on my hard drive that I need to finish one of these days. Basically it'd let you copy the materials from one texture/model to another.
If you really wanted it now, then I would use RailMoveWaterObj, the only reason most people don't like that is because it's a simple cube and most planets are not boxes. Basically the way it works is you have a model(RailMoveWaterObj or otherwise), and then the collision of where to trigger the swimming mode(WaterArea), it's weird but I guess it makes sense. The scale is ~0.7x the model in RailMoveWaterObj's case, they only have 3 examples and they're all in the same map but two are 1 for scale in the model and 0.7 in the collision, and the other is 0.7 scale model and 0.5 scale collision, and 0.7*0.7 is ~0.5(0.49) so it works on the small scale. There is a difference in the y coordinate, but I assume that's for the path of it. IDK, play around with offsets and see what you get, and if you need to know more, I'd check the Object Database. Something to note is that RailMoveWaterObj is in MapParts and uses the heavily undocumented clipping setting, so that makes it kinda iffy, but copying the settings should work for most stuff you'd use it for. There are some forms of the water that are part of the planet(one that comes to mind is fluffy bluff), and they use the planet's collision instead of an object (there's like 4 different collision types/splashing effects for the "level of the water"), but they also use the materials trick. Hope that helps! ____________________ "I hate playing musical chats" ~ Quote of the month |
| Krazyguy75 |
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Normal user Level: 23 Posts: 19/100 EXP: 60596 Next: 7127 Since: 03-28-14 Last post: 3219 days ago Last view: 2938 days ago |
Ew. You think they could have come up with some simpler way to deal with water, but, whatever. I'll try to figure it out. |
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